...because I have not the time or training yet. You really should be debating Fr. Robert Barron. I've attended a retreat with him and he is brilliant. Start with this vidio, work your way through the rest, and perhaps chech out his site. As you can see in the YouTube comments, he actively answer questions/challenges. He does it so much better then I ever could and he should, he's the Francis Cardinal George Chair of Faith and Culture at University of St. Mary of the Lake/Mundelein Seminary in Mundelein, Illinois.
Sorry about the delay, but I'm over loaded with reading, writing and general seminary business.
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6 comments:
Well, that's no fun! I want someone I can beat. hehe
We'll see. But I'd rather just chat with you and Sarita. Whenever time permits. I know Sarita has been feeling ill and I know you have a time stricture. But I'll be expecting something by summertime, if not before, bucko!
Hi guys!!!! Yes much better now... and I also found my gmail password tht I lost. Life is good :)
Just got home from work, need to walk the dog and most important.....EAT! So will be back. How is everyone, except for catholic, which we know is loaded down with seminary stuff. I remember those days.... although I dont know if my 2 years of Vineyard Leadership Institute would be the same as yours. This is the Vineyards version of seminary. Yours sounds harder.
Umm... by the way, what makes you think you can "beat" me? :P You cant !!! Should I stop now??
Oh, and thanks for the compliment, Jay! :)
Well, put me down as hating youtube's posting process. I got so frustrated I gave up and just sent Barron my response in private email. Here's my fallible but sincere comments:
You begin by talking about the desire for truth, which many of us have. However, I'd disagree that it's a universal trait of everyone. Many persons do not, IMO, have a desire for truth. They'd either rather be lazy about the meaning of life or are scared of the possibility of having their worldview shattered and thus do not question the truth they've settled on. But more striking than these two options is that among those who do desire truth (and I count myself among them), we come to different conclusions. One thing that led me eventually to atheism was the plurality of religion, the plurality of meaning. For you, God means the Christian god and specifically the Catholic variant. Many Protestants who cite the same scriptures have problems with the Catholic interpretation. Jews and Muslims see aspects of Christianity as false, not the least of which is the doctrine of the incarnation. Hindus derive from one god, Brahman, a multitude of aspects. Buddhist, in there version of truth, find no god at all but a system wherein all desires are quieted, assumedly even the search for truth.
You say God equals justice. I'm not sure how you can make such a claim nor what your basis is. What do you consider the Tanakh to be? Is it history? Legend? Myth? A bit of all three? But I do wonder what the justice was in the slaughter of the Amalekites. I'd also question the justice of sending folks to hell simply because their search for truth leads them to doubt the central tenet of Christianity!
Scientists begin with one assumption: the universe follows rules. And these rules can be discovered via observation and repeated testing. Richard Dawkins thinks God is a testable hypothesis and I agree. If he's not, then how can we even know he exists? As the "deep desire" for justice and knowledge isn't universal, as I propose, that fails as a measuring stick.
You say the universe is imbued with meaning. I say we give it meaning. My own faith statement, perhaps, but one that bears out based on observation of that pluralism I mentioned.
I think the statement "we have to go outside the world" is incoherent. Can you elaborate?
Test all things,
Peace,
The Infidel
Well, Barron hadn't responded but I noticed him responding to the trolls. So I posted a comment letting him know I'd left him a youtube email. Hopefully we'll see what response he has, if any.
Still waiting for Barron to respond. It seems he's happy to banter with one guy about what Barron calls his "rants" but not respond to mine. Makes me wonder.....
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